If you are concerned about static electricity sparking a fire, there are ways to ground PVC piping to mitigate that risk. Is this normal?
That restriction will come in the form of your ducting. When I did the same with the cyclone the airspeed was too great so I had to take a reading with the meter just outside of the end of the pipe. 2014-2020. More of a curiosity than anything else. One way of reducing dust is with dust collectors. The one saving factor with this is the flapper in the filter actually works to dislodge the sawdust into the collection bag The bag can be easily emptied into the bin and it all can be wheeled out of the shop. There have been several versions of the DC-850. Also, would I improve my suction much if I went with two filter bags (one on top and also one on the bottom instead of the plastic bag)? I also tried to get a reading at the collectors inlet but the air speed exceeded the range on my meter after cleaning the filter on my old collector. Picture a rectangular box, maybe 8" tall by 22" wide by 44" long. With that test out of the way, I emptied the filter bag into the drum and I could empty it for the first time. All logos and trademarks in this site are property of woodworkweb and/or their respective owner(s). In-House Pressure Filtration Laboratory Services, Vacuum Filtration Field Maintenance & Repair Services, In-House Vacuum Filtration Laboratory Services, Process Auditing, Consulting, and Vacuum Equipment Optimization, Custom-Engineered Solutions and Baghouse Retrofits, In-House Laboratory Testing Dry Filtration, Leak Detection Powder & Inspection Lights, Baghouse Retrofits, Rebuilds & System Upgrades. Now, in order to gain from the modification, you'll have to upgrade your ducting to 6" diameter. Our team can design, fabricate, and install clean air plenums, tube sheets, and hoppers, and we can reline/rebuild clean and dirty air plenum walls. In my opinion, though, its not the risk the internet has made it out to be. Crimping Tool: http://amzn.to/2iqKc9e You have to consider which is your most demanding branch in your duct network. Today is a pretty exciting day today because look what was delivered! They are all identical, except for color and the rims have nice flat parts which make them very suitable to adapting to a cyclone collector top. But do your research! In the top of the box, cut out two holes, and mount both filters there, side-by-side. I have not seen a system so far that I like, that can be quickly and easily changed and will adapt to 3 or 4 other barrels for quick swapping. Notify me of followup comments via e-mail. The flappers which are supposed to dislodge the dust trapped in the pleats dont really work so the best way to shake the dust loose is to beat the crap out of the filter. I reinstalled the filter and tested the airflow again. Downstream, it's perfectly fine to have a 6" drop splitting to two 4" ducts to serve smaller machines like a router-table, etc. I don't know much about dust collection systems and want it as efficient as possible with my current resources. All this sawdust is from dust leaking out of the collection bag if the bag get nicked by something and tears slightly. Don't close one of the 4" ducts. Similarly, did you look at Gripple hangers? It would help when removing this part to break up the styrofoam holding it to the bottom of the crate. From contributor M: I am thinking about putting the whole thing on wheels so it can be moved around if needed. I picked it up with the idea that when I had time I would install it. The Micronics Engineered Filtration Group and leading brands CPE, UPC, NFM, and Filterfab can provide the knowledge, expertise, and manpower to convert your existing dust collector to a more functional and efficient system. Fortunately, that dc has manual thermal overload protection. Some worked better than others. I did the best I could with the materials I could afford and the space I have. Which size pipe is best, how do I calculate the resistance of a duct system, what is the minimum horsepower for my layout, how do I ensure Im meeting the minimum CFM required at a particular tool? I found that very few dust particles were making it to the second stage, which means the air in my collector was probably coming at least somewhat cleaner than before. There are no serious weight or pressure issues. If using a spiral or snap-lock pipe, use duct sealant. 10% off in stock chair kits with coupon code CHAIRS Dismiss. In-depth articles, up-close photography, and detailed illustrations. Do you see any problems with this setup or ways that I can improve without a lot of cost? I turned the cyclone on for the first time and could hear stuff rattling through the pipes towards the collector. When ever you are working with dust collectors it is imperative that they be as air tight as possible, otherwise their efficiency drops drastically. That dc has a 6" intake. Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. Go with 1 micron filters. By reducing to 4", you're reducing the area of the duct by more than half.
UNLIMITED membership - Get access to it all. No chop saw needed. This time I went with 8-in. Today is the start of a very exciting thing: converting our wall of OSB to a wall, Welcome back to our home renovation and remodel project.
Nice system, but I'm a little surprised you didn't investigate (or maybe you rejected and just don't mention it?) /r/woodworking is your home on reddit for furniture, toys, tools, wood, glue, and anything else that has to do with woodworking as a hobby or profession. Join Mike and dive into information overload I did way too much reading when preparing for this installation because I plan to use this system for many years, and I want it to function well. This leads me to my first and most important tip, design a dust-collection system with flexibility in mind. So performance was alright. Next comes the piping.
With the holidays upon us, Mike Farrington made a list of a few of his favorite tools and shop supplies that will make your woodworking better. Unboxing the cyclone was pretty easy. 
Since the motor stuck up higher than the garage door rails, it had to be tipped and rolled into place. 2022 The Taunton Press, Inc. All rights reserved. If that is the case, and you'd like to use the lower plastic waste bag, then you can add the plenum, with the two top-mounted filters. The way this works is that most of the dust is collected in the first stage, the cyclone stage, thus preventing much of the dust to enter the second stage, which in turn helps to cut down on dust particles being expelled through the dust collector's filtering system. Also, many times its very hard to get a good seal with tape in an awkward position like an inside corner. It's okay to split a 6" duct to two 4" ducts using a wye, but you need to keep both of those 4" ducts open (no blast-gate) to feed the 6". 
Take a look if you are so inclined. Further, adding elbows also increases resistance. You may find that with the increased air capability, your dc sucks the pre-separator clean.
I was very happy with mine. One of the first upgrades to a single stage dust collector is to make it a "Two Stage" dust collector by adding something called a cyclone style extractor to the existing unit. That will reduce flow in the 6" main. JDS and Laguna both make collectors that can be adjusted. I installed a reducer by screwing it to the inlet and sealing and smoothing the transition with silicone. If you use vertical drops, your dc has to be able to pull close to 800 cfm in order to get that 4000fpm velocity. I contact cemented and screwed aluminum flashing to the inside before assembly to ground the system. Job Opportunities and Woodworking Services, Dust Collection, Safety and Plant Operation, Dust Collection, Safety, Plant Management. The old collector, even at maximum performance, wasnt able to clear everything out of the tools and pipes.
I just ran flexible hose to three locations along my work areas and to my miter saw and one floor sweep, all with 4" flexible pipe.
You'll be astonished. In the end, I took the knowledge I picked up from reading and made the best decisions I could relative to my shop and layout. Locate tools as close to the dust collector as possible. Remember, dc's are "air movers." So the body of any collector would need to fit under these rails and a motor or something narrow could fit up between the rails but under the ceiling height. WOODWEB is a registered trademark of Woodweb.com. and 6-in. That would create a massive increase in resistance. We offer end-to-end solutions from Filter Media to Industry-Leading Filtration Equipment, to Spare Parts & Accessories, to On-Site Field Services and In-House Laboratory Services. I mainly used it for my table saw with 4" pipe and it has worked fine. Moreover, watch for deals on this website and eBay for a quality used one. You'll need to make some filter mounting flanges. Get woodworking tips, expert advice and special offers in your inbox. If you have that 12" impeller, you'll get a dramatic improvement in flow, simply by adding a second filter-bag. This time I went with sealant, and so far its been great. After having run this system for a few weeks now, I am happy to report the dust collector barrel indicator, the little bar that I push down to see how full the barrel is, works great. Drop me a line and ask a question about Urban Logging, Woodworking, or my beard. You could also mount both filters to the top of the dc, and keep the plastic lower bag. Learn how your comment data is processed. Micronics Is Your Trusted Partner for Total Engineered Filtration Solutions. The table saw was the worst performing, because it had the longest ductwork (straight 4" round along floor and up to the plenum). In a horizontal main, you only need 3500 fpm. Great video. In fact, you might now be pulling only 400 cfm. Its starting to warm up, so were back, Welcome back to our home renovation and remodel project. Just enough to allow you to snugly slip your filters over the flanges, and add a filter clamp. Thanks in advance. Here are a few tips I have picked up along the way. The Excel file for these results is also available. Watch the assembly video and shave a couple hours off of the assembly time. Keep your ducting efficient with a small dc like this. Here's an example: Let's say your 6" pipe is pulling 800 cfm. Providing enough static pressure capability (suction) is quite another. HVAC elbows only cost about $3 - $4 each. Since two 4" pipes is roughly equal in area to a single 6" pipe (about 90% actually), you'll create little extra resistance, and you'll pull enough air to properly feed the 6" pipe. The piping needs to be connected tightly between the units and there are special hose clamps for this that give a better grip to help reduce air leaks.
Behind the 6" blower intake, some versions of the dc-850 have a 5" restrictor collar. Butt them together. For now the small bar clamps work but there must be something out there that is a bit more elegant. Running the free-breathing dc, unrestricted, say with a very short, large diameter duct, might cause overheating. Perhaps marginally more money? Become a member and get unlimited site access, including the I was just curious if it was possible to get a motor with more hp, and at the same time remain safe. Reducing the number of turns and feet of pipe is an easy way to keep the performance of a dust collector as close to its maximum as possible. Adding a separator to my system was something I was never interested in because it would just perpetuate my real problem: the collector is undersized for my shop. It would be much cleaner to run a bead of silicone on the seams before screwing the parts together. PVC piping, and I purchased materials from a landscape supply house. Then I cut holes in the front of the plenum/main duct for waste gates near each tool. Buy your ducting from a local professional supplier. ductwork, I really think PVC is a great material. It isn't that I am having trouble from the motor.
The pre-separator will add a little resistance. I hope that we as woodworkers continue to improve our understanding of what good dust collection is and that tool manufacturers keep designing tools with better built-in collections. Sign up for eletters today and get the latest techniques and how-to from Fine Woodworking, plus special offers. I also had the issue of the cyclone exceeding the maximum on the meter when I took readings on the planer and table saw. If you use piping designed for home clothes dryers for example, the suction of the much higher pressured dust collectors will collapse the tubes, so you need plastic tubing designed to carry the load. Its been a long time coming but Im finally upgrading my dust collector to something appropriately sized for my shop! These are often not the best, but for many of us they are best we can afford and install, and in recent years they are actually doing a pretty good job. Very inexpensive to do, as well. Collecting Dust or at least preventing the distribution of dust in the workshop has been an active topic among woodworkers for a long, long time and I expect it will continue to be as new information, changes in the industry and new methods continue to evolve. PVC. The articles found in this collection cover all facets of dust collectionfrom finding the right dust collector to getting the most out of your current collector, from organizing your shop for efficient dust collection to designing a ductwork system. spiral steel piping. All systems will have some amount of compromise. Some collectors have a fixed inlet straight out the end of the collector so the collector would have to be placed in line with the pipe or a 90 degree elbow would have to be installed right at the inlet. They provide rubber covers to go over the ends of the screws to protect the collection bag from getting holes poked in it. The cyclone was already pulling dust through the system that the old collector missed. Increasing airflow dramatically will result in a surge in required horsepower, which could overwhelm the small motor, unless you provide proper restriction. Long-radius elbows are better than tight radius, etc. There are a few changes I still want to make on my system. I have had 2 barrels full so far and no overflows at least so far. Wind Speed Meter: http://amzn.to/2iXcQCL As it is now, I can not use more than one collection system at a time. This was so much easier than trying to carry a heavy bag of sawdust! I also took the mindset that if it didnt work as well as I wanted, I would just have to make changes. Having a drum on casters is so much better than dealing with a bag of sawdust. I can't really tell that has reduced the dust in my workshop but it has made collecting the dust easier, more convenient and far less dusty than trying to unhook plastic bags full of dust and get them out of the workshop. I also took the same readings with the cyclone hooked up to the system. CFM = Cross Sectional Area of the Pipe (in sqft) X Air Speed (in ft/min). With the tests out of the way, I can removed the old collector and clean up the mess that was behind it. If anybody has seen any more mods or different upgrades for the harbor freight dust collector that have worked for you, please post them here. Both of these set ups wouldnt be that practical given the space I have for the collector so I opted to only look at collectors with adjustable inlet angles. A small Fein shop-vac can provide up to 100" WC of suction, which would be 11-12 times higher than your dc. Foil HVAC tape?
Creating Roof Slopes with Tapered Insulation. We seem to be at odds about how much is safe and which dusts are worse than others, but the safe rule of thumb is NO dust is good and ALL dust should not be inhaled. No pipe dope, not crimping, no pop rivets. This site is protected by reCAPTCHA and the Google, Used tools are this woodworkers best friend, Editor's Letter: Technology and the future of woodworking. Converting your existing equipment can typically be done for around half the cost of replacing it. Roughly $50. For smaller shops like mine, a typical dust collector is often a 1.5 and up to a 3 horsepower electric fan that draws dust from our machinery and deposits the dust it into a plastic bag while using an upper cloth bag or composite canister to filter the small particles of dust and return fresh air to the room. To calculate the CFM based on the air speed reading is pretty simple. The selection process for me was pretty straight forward. My shop always seems to be in a state of re-arrangement so having all my tools on wheels is important. So if you are looking to install a system in your shop and are confused by the information thats out there, that makes two of us. dust collectors, table saw, bandsaw, etc) cannot be upgrading for ones with increased horsepower? I have included links to a couple of videos I recently posted to my magnificent YouTube channel that cover my dust-collection installation as well as overarm dust-collection shrouds. The longer your duct network, the more static pressure resistance you're adding. This stage removes the majority of the dust from the air stream before it his the collector. In my case I have added and Oneida cyclone style collector to my existing dust collector. I used flexible plastic tubing designed for dust collectors. My dad helped me move the cyclone into position. On a small dc like yours, there is not much room for static pressure loss. This will avoid vertical drops that require 4000 fpm velocity for appropriate particle suspension. With all this sawdust on the floor, I first wanted to test how easy it would be to overwhelm the cyclone. Compounded with that is the height of the garage door rails in the same area. The ring-clamps with o-rings are not only air tight, but so simple to take apart and reassemble if you move/add/sell tools, move the whole shop etc. My understanding is that tight angles reduce air flow.
That's where it *should* be. I established a baseline of what Im typically experiencing and used to by taking measurements with my old collector before changing anything. Your email address will not be published. Remove that collar, otherwise you won't be able to use your 6" pipe effectively.
Replacing the lower plastic bag with a filter-bag is the easiest. Later, once you've ducted the dc to your machines, you may find that you have plenty of suction. I think it worked because the inside was pretty smooth, and the air had a straight shot from the waste gates into the collector, and the flex hose from the waste gates to each tool was pretty short. Not really a real world scenario but interesting regardless. Home > Dry / Baghouse Filtration > Services > Baghouse Maintenance & Repair Services > Retrofits, Conversions & Upgrades. You really shouldn't ever reduce the size (diameter) of your duct. Total cost of modification = 1 filterbag. Thank you for these links, I am buying one of these dcs on Wednesday and I would love to set mine up like LJ link #1. it seems like the motor is the best part of that unit. I think that long runs of flexible hose will be cutting down the efficiency because of the corrugated surfaces inside. I cut down and crimped a piece of straight pipe to connect the cyclone to the pipe in the ceiling. This is a great way to go for a shop where the collector is sized correctly but the filter needs to be cleaned too often. Its very top heavy. The motor can be wired 110v, or 220 v. I'd go with the 220v and a proper circuit provided for that. This bin also needs to be sealed with silicone. Velocity through that pipe is roughly 4000fpm. Ive found that duct tape over time tends to work its way loose. Firstly is overhead clearance. New tools and shop layout changes are a part of the game. In this shop though, its undersized. I have the one filter bag on top and a plastic waste bag that the dust settles in. The most difficult part of the assembly is standing the unit upright. My system is the best Ive done so far, but its far from perfect. In my view dust collection is extremely under-researched, especially for the small shop. This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. If you do decide to keep it (pre-sep), then you have to start thinking about replacing that lid with one that has a 6" or larger hook-up. That is simply tack-welded in place. All rights reserved unless otherwise provided as noted, please report any copyright infringements to the email noted elswhere on this site. Where the collector goes, I have a max ceiling height of 85. The inlet doesnt go quite to 90 degrees on this side of the unit, so an adjustable elbow is installed to point the inlet back a bit and upwards to meet the pipe on the ceiling. The drum comes a sheet steel that gets screwed together. I could have bought them, but I thought it would be a fun challenge to make them and save a few bucks at the same time. Moving more air is one thing. Shop Machines Project Guide. Love the Simpsons reference in the name caption :-). This effectively takes the single stage dust collector to a 2 stage collector. Micronics Engineered Filtration Group, Inc. Whether for your Filter Press, Belt Press, Leaf Filter, Vacuum Filter, or Baghouse, you can count on Micronics deep industry and applications knowledge for the right engineered filtration solution to meet your needs. Its easy to cut and assemble, and the way the fittings come together combined with the super-smooth inside of the pipe makes for a great dust pipe. With the old collector, I placed the meter inside of the hose thinking I would get more consistent results this way. Then for the second layer, just stagger the joint 90 degrees. Get complete site access to video workshops, digital plans library, online archive, and more, plus the print magazine. Forum Responses
Detailed advice on beefing up the capacity of a dust collection system in a small shop. The rest of the assembly process went smoothly no thanks to the instruction manual. I dont plan to use bags with this collector so for a cleaner look and feel, I cut the screws flush. The Micronics Engineered Filtration team excels in expertly custom-engineered Air Pollution Control (APC) Solutions including economical Baghouse Retrofits, Rebuilds & System Upgrades. That plenum would be a simple box with a hole cut out of the bottom, and mounted where your present filter is mounted. Another advantage of the 2 stage collector system is that often it is easier to change or replace that part that is collecting the dust. Buy or build shrouds and fixtures. I had my tools clustered in one corner of the shop so the runs to each tool werent that long. Finally, the weather has turned to something tolerable! The other thing I still want to change is how the lid attaches to the collection barrel underneath. This is the fourth system I have installed over the years, so I have learned a few things along the way. The next space constraint is the area the collector goes in and the way my ducting enter that area. Cyclone: http://bit.ly/2ldfTqT The screws are much longer than needed and sharp. Press J to jump to the feed. I had to make sure the cyclone was sealed to the wood, and that the wooden top could seal tightly to the plastic garbage can bases. For this installation, I decided to try using a brushable duct sealant rather than duct tape. The only cyclones that fit this constraint are the compact/mobile cyclone which limits me to the manufacturers that make that style of collector. I dont know about spiral ducting, but the steel Nordfab ones are easily cut by drilling an access hole (twist bit), inserting a hand held jig saw (metal cutting blade), and rotating the pipe into the blade. In normal cases, the cyclone has to separate a small steady stream of sawdust but when sucking up large masses of debris, huge amounts enter the cyclone all at once and larger quantities dont get separated out and pass right into the filter. As I was thinking about that, I got to thinking about upgrading the motors on other tools. September 24, 2006.
Become an UNLIMITED member and get it all: searchable online archive of every issue, how-to videos, Complete Illustrated Guide to Woodworking digital series, print magazine, e-newsletter, and more. I have a shop that is roughly the same size as yours and also started out with a small dust collector. Here are some of the mods I have seen: Jay's Custom Creations, Lumberjocks, Lumberjocks 2, Charles Tubbs' mod. That would allow you to mount two 20" diameter filters side-by-side on top of the plenum. Rectangular or square, approximately 6x6 inside. Of course, you'd need bag-mounting flanges, so if your filters are 20" diameter, cut two 17" diameter holes in the top of the plenum, and you can make flanges by using MDF rings. We will see if it holds up over time. Also, does it have the 6" intake? The results of this were pretty much what I expected. There was a large amount of debris in the filter bag. Last, you can check for leaks by running your system and holding a candle under the duct joints; the smoke will get pulled into the poorly sealed joint.
If you are going to install a system with 6-in. The DC was at one end of the plen/main duct.
Start your 14-day FREE trial - and get building. I read pretty much everything I could find, and I came to the conclusion that there was no way to fully and accurately calculate as well as understand each decision that goes into designing a dust-collection system. All I had to so was to make a base for the cyclone collector to sit on, which I did with a couple of layers of plywood, the bolt the cyclone top to, making sure it was well sealed. To save on MDF, instead of cutting full 20" circles, you can make half circles. I'm sorry if there is an obvious answer to this and I look stupid; I just honestly didn't know. The purpose of a dual or 2 stage dust collector is try to make the air cleaner by trapping more dust in the first stage of the dust collector which turns out to be the cyclone part that was added on. Suction is nowhere near as strong in a dc. The 3hp JDS is always on backorder so I decided to go with the Laguna since it has better availability. And after all this is done, you finally get a chance to test the system by cleaning out the 2 stage of your collector and seeing what it can do. If you decide to do the blower modification (removing 5" restrictor, behind 6" intake), then just replace that plastic lower bag with the 1 micron filter-bag. For this dust masks are highly recommended. Everything was well packaged and arranged in the crate. I bought this single stage dust collector when I was in my only shop back in 2010. Its even harder to find answers backed up by math. collection hose. It worked pretty well in that space. Looking at these results, Ill have to empty the filter bag once for every 5 drums of sawdust I collect. After a few minutes of that (and a few piles of fine dust on my lawn later), a leaf blower can be used to blow off any remaining dust (theres still a lot trapped in there). or 4" to a saw's base, and another 4" to an overarm blade-cover. Be forewarned, however. All rights reserved. The DC I had (Jet, I think) had a rectangular intake when the adaptor for hose was removed. Make your rings 1 1/2" wide. These units with collect and expel dust in one unit are called Single Stage Dust Collectors One of the problems with single stage dust collectors is that they are often hard to empty when they get full, without causing more dust. Next I wanted to test the real world separation ability of the cyclone because the biggest disadvantage of a compact cyclone is they are not as good at departing than a full sized tall cyclone (or so Ive heard). But I still can't get 100% from my tablesaws with a 7.5 hp cyclone! Your dc will draw less air. There are several ways to go about this. Youd need a friend to help with this or an overhead lift. Shop size won't necessarily dictate what size dc you need. The joints get screwed together with self tapping sheet metal screws and once Im done changing some of the other pipe out, Ill seal the seams with foil tape. My last system was 6-in. Thank you for any insight you may have. One thing that can be done to improve a single stage unit is to add a separation stage before the collector.
Don't bother making the plenum to top-mount both filters. In the end, what Im really interested in with these CFM readings is the change in airflow throughout the various cases.
Required fields are marked *. I noticed you have some tight angles where the flex hose attaches to a machine (jointer, bandsaw, table saw blade shroud). I used an anemometer to measure the airspeed at the planer, table saw, and lathe. I have some unique space constraints. You would probably be better off with pipe. Here are a few ways you can show us some love. The same was true when I bought the 6-in. The best was to make a plenum/main duct from particleboard. I still wear a dust mask and probably always will, you can never be too cautious about inhaling dust the less we inhale the better. This test case will represent the best case scenario and establishes the maximum amount of air this collector is capable of moving.
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